Page And Domain Back Links

[ademartin]

Hi Folks,

Here's one for our more experienced 30DC' ers with a bent, if that's the right word :-) for SEO.

Domain and Page back links. It's a given we already know about anchor text, bad neighbourhoods and we are only talking about Google here.

Page Back Links

My confusion arises because I "think" I heard Andy Jenkins say somewhere that the importance of external back links, as regarded by Google, is exactly the same as links within your site. Since I heard this I have been pondering...

If this is the case why do we bother with the hassle of getting external back links at all?

I appreciate that in the case of a .edu or .gov link it is worth having because of the Google "juice" and I guess that if our site is a PR 1 or 2 then a link from a more authoritative site is obviously beneficial.

I think that as I type I am answering my own questions but I'll still post this in case I am missing something which at my age is quite possible!

Domain Back Links

What is the modern thinking on this? If an article is listed in the search results from a site like Ezine Articles, Wikipedia or about.com there is no, (generally, but I appreciate this is changing), On Page Optimization as the result is dynamically generated.

The article will have been returned by Google because of its title and keywords in the body content.

So how important are the Domain Back links?

We also have to be careful because although the domain may be shown as a PR 5 or 6 Google does not PR a domain. The PR is for a page only so it is quite possible that the home page of a site could have a PR 6 but the page it returns could have a PR 0 - which happens quite a lot if you look at blog and forum posts.

This demonstrates the importance of proper linking to individual posts and web pages.

So, is my thinking a load of twaddle? I am just trying to get updated on the importance of external / internal linking and also the relevance of a high PR authority site returning a result where the article itself is not a high PR.

Hope I made some sense...

<Ade curls up in a ball muttering "think happy thoughts, think happy thoughts, think happy thoughts">

Cheers,

Ade

[ThomasH]

Ade, hello.
I'm going to add my .02 on a quick post since it's getting late and tomorrow is another busy day :-)
The whole idea in building traffic is to dominate a series of key words and long-tail key word phrases.
The only way to do that is for the "site"-domain to be perceived by Google and other major engines as an "authority" site.
ALL things being equal, a site with no back-links will never dominate an exact duplicate site with thousands of backlinks. The algorithm is simple - Google loves links - both backlinks and internal links within your site (cross-linking) between articles.
I think you're trying to make things too complicated.
Until their model changes, just get lots of back-links and properly cross-link your content.
The more and "better" links you have coming into your site, the "more" of an authority site Google will "perceive" you to be.
Just kick social marketing into overdrive and enjoy the traffic.
Try Social bookmarking service. Fast tagging and posting to all major social websites - SocialMarker.com for some great easy to do back-links.
Hope that helps - cheers.

[bigebiz]

Originally Posted by ademartin

Hi Folks,

Here's one for our more experienced 30DC' ers with a bent, if that's the right word :-) for SEO.

Domain Back Links

What is the modern thinking on this? If an article is listed in the search results from a site like Ezine Articles, Wikipedia or about.com there is no, (generally, but I appreciate this is changing), On Page Optimization as the result is dynamically generated.

The article will have been returned by Google because of its title and keywords in the body content.

So how important are the Domain Back links?

We also have to be careful because although the domain may be shown as a PR 5 or 6 Google does not PR a domain. The PR is for a page only so it is quite possible that the home page of a site could have a PR 6 but the page it returns could have a PR 0 - which happens quite a lot if you look at blog and forum posts.

This demonstrates the importance of proper linking to individual posts and web pages.

So, is my thinking a load of twaddle? I am just trying to get updated on the importance of external / internal linking and also the relevance of a high PR authority site returning a result where the article itself is not a high PR.

Cheers,

Ade

Lets see if I can break this down and make this a Sticky SEO post.

Google Search Algorithm is based upon many factors. The Algorithm is a mathematical formula that gives percentage weights to different factors in it equation.

Example: Lets say their are 100 factors that are taken into account to determine what Ranks where in Google. The Formula would say be A+B+C+D etc = Search Engine Rank. Google with give a % weight to different factors and change that weight % at their discretion. So from our formula factor is could be A(.004)+B(.01)+C(.9)+D(1.2) .... = Google Search Rank.

The Current Google Algorithm does base a heavier percentage weight on factors such as BackLinks, Keyword in URL, Keyword in TITLE.

To determine Why X is ranking higher than Y you have to LOOK at the individual Keyword search rankings. NO TWO Search Results can be comparable because of too many variable. There are too many Factors to say a broad scope it will aways be the one with More Links or the one with MORE On site Seo etc.

From your Ezine Article Example: And if you search for "MY Name" you see this Bare out. Ezine Articles has 900,000 Backlinks. My Name biz has 600 My Name .com has 3 backlinks. My Listing in IMDB scrapped directory for a movie I was in has 21,000,0000 Backlinks.

Ezine Ranked Higher because of More Backlinks overall plus weight of MY Name as anchor Links from articles and More References Related with Higher PR LINKS than my own Name Domain site. The 21 Million back Link site is only Referencing my Name briefly and not enough to make it #1 results.

Overview of Backlinks:
Domain Backlinks should be considered and will probably always be the Highest weight percentage factor in the Google Algorithm.

Even if the percentage weight is lower, backlinks are one of the only Variable factors from a Mathematical standpoint that can be Altered or expanded upon. Think in terms of There is only One MAIN URL Domain, their is only ONE TITLE per website page, Their are only so Many H1 tags, Images with Tag etc that constitute the make up of a website.

Backlinks are the Variable Term in the math formula.

Comparing Site A to Site B and say everything is exactly the same Duplicate content for the sake of Argument so that all ONSITE factors are rated the same way and same percentage. Site A is Keyword .com site B is keywords .com

Site A has 1000 Backlinks
Site B has 1500 Backlinks

We assume Site B will rank above Site A in the Search Engine Results. Normally this is true. When we SEE Sight A with less Backlinks out rank Site B with More Backlinks we have to ask ourselves WHY?

We look at the Backlinks. Where are they coming From? What are the Anchor text in the backlink.

Site A 1000 Back Links has 900 Links with "Keyword" in the anchor text of the backlink. Site B has more overall links, but only 300 of those are "Keyword Anchor Links". Therefore Site A with less links Ranked Higher for "Keyword".

When you think in terms of a Math Equation Formula, the only thing you can continue to increase is Backlinks with Keyword Anchors.


Google PR - ( Google Page Rank is a rating system, not to be confused with Google Ranking or Search Engine Rank 'SERP' the position a website is listed from a keyword Google Search typically #1 - #10 )

Generically, PR is just an equation per actual URL of the amount of Inbound and Outbound Links. A Inbound LINK - Outbound LINK = PR. PR is not determined exclusively to a domain but rather to it's own individual urls or pages that make up that domain.

Example: Domain. com and domain. com/blog and domain .com/blog/post

Domain .com typically has the Highest Google PR, because normal website structure is designed that there are LINKS form all sub pages, sub directories linking Back to the domain .com ( typically a HOME, or even a Footer Domain .com Link). Internal pages PASS Google PR. Domain .com also normally has more LINKS pointing to it from internal pages and external sites so that the INBOUND Links minus OUTBOUND are Higher, hence Higher Google Page Rank PR.

Domain .com/blog at times will have more Google PR than HOME page because MORE Backlinks coming to that URL than are linking off. But that URL string is independent of it's Home page in terms of Google PR rate.

Basically every single URL will have it's own PR Rating. PR is passed across all area's in which it links out towards.

All that to say, GOOGLE PR is not a highly weighted factor in the Algorithm.

People backlink to their Home page as well as to internal pages to gain more value to their entire site as well as pages of their site, so that they can Rank better in Google. Smart Linking goes not only to the Home page Internally and with external link building but also the Individual pages of your Site, blog whatever.


So all that to get to here:
I am just trying to get updated on the importance of external / internal linking and also the relevance of a high PR authority site returning a result where the article itself is not a high PR.

Google PR update Daily if not quicker internally in their databases, visible PR updates maybe every 3-6-9 Months.

The Authority Site is ranking Higher because it is passing on Weight to that Keyword Term.

However a properly On site SEO, Keyword in the Domain URL, and decent amount of backlinks can over take the Authority Site for the Search Engine Result because, it is now gaining more of the percentage weights and factors of the Google Algorithm.

Eric Gehler ( bigebiz)

[ademartin]

Thanks to both Thomas and Eric for your replies.

Thomas, you are absolutely right, I can over complicate things and when I see this happening I get back to basics and start putting the square and triangle building blocks back into their respective slots. Your post helped, thanks very much.

Eric. A few good takeaways for me...

"Backlinks are the Variable Term in the math formula"

Absolutely right. This puts everything in place for me. Excellent statement.

"When you think in terms of a Math Equation Formula, the only thing you can continue to increase is Backlinks with Keyword Anchors."

And of course this would be important for both external and internal linking strategies.

"However a properly On site SEO, Keyword in the Domain URL, and decent amount of backlinks can over take the Authority Site for the Search Engine Result because, it is now gaining more of the percentage weights and factors of the Google Algorithm."

Spot on.

Sincerely appreciate your time.

Ade

[craftscn]

Content webpage for back link is attach more importance. If your original comtent webpage have one relevant back link, it will upgrade your list at search engine. I ever test it in my craft blog.

[Isha]

It would be great if this thread was made into a sticky again. I keep referring other people to it & it helped me a lot when I was first starting out.

[Jon Dean]

Originally Posted by Isha

It would be great if this thread was made into a sticky again. I keep referring other people to it & it helped me a lot when I was first starting out.

Want it stickied? Done!

[Isha]

Jon you are an angel

Thank you

[Channing Jordon]

Google's updates for searches happen daily, but you are going against sites that have been active and visited for years. The average amount of time for a site to "get noticed" on Google Searches is about four to six months, depending on how much traffic the site gets.

[gonnadoit]

Million thanks, Bigebiz, for a MOST helpful and readable post on SEO ... a subject I've been strangling with for about 3 months now as a newbie. It feels like i'm moving my chair closer and closer to the internet table through your kind of clarity.